Bannister Mall/Cerner

[earthling]

I once worked for Sprint (3 month contract) but didn't stay partly because it was in suburbia but also had to drive between buildings for a freakin meeting (Southlake Tech Park). Though also had better offer in city. Cerner's new campus is heading in same direction, looks like some might have to drive between buildings for meetings. Just build a few 50 story buildings next to each other and be done with it.

[mistervinix]

Can anyone tell me if it's normal for a project of this scope not to have (or at least disclose) more detailed renderings than the ones they've shown the public? I remember seeing detailed renderings of the Cerner towers in KCK at the time that project broke ground. Seems odd that they aren't out there yet. The renderings we've seen so far are very vague. I would think Cerner would be wanting to publicize their grand vision (if, indeed they have one).

[aknowledgeableperson]

I would imagine that this project can change as time goes on. This is so much more than the KCK project. They know how it will start but who knows how it will end.

[KCMax]

Cerner breaks ground for its Trails Campus in south Kansas City

Shovels struck dirt Wednesday afternoon on the seventh Kansas City area office complex for fast-growing Cerner Corp., a huge $4.45 billion project intended to house 16,000 new Cerner workers within the decade.

[im2kull]

$4.45 Billion is more than the entire amount of money spent on EVERY major project in the Downtown and greater downtown area over the last 15 years..if not more. This project is a mindboggling waste of taxpayer money. Absolutely horrendous. You could build 8 footballs stadiums or baseball stadiums for that much money..easily. We could have DT stadiums, the 3rd hall on the Performing Arts Center, and soooo much more! This is what makes me sick about KC. So much waste.

[pash]

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[aknowledgeableperson]

$4.45 Billion

How much of that is tax dollars?

[pash]

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[KCMax]

Cerner's getting $1.75 billion is public money over twenty-some years. The cost of construction is estimated at $2.32 billion (also spread over a long time period), and they're saying $2.12 billion in financing costs. So about 38.5% of the headline number of $4.54 billion is coming from taxpayers.

That probably underestimates the true subsidy.

But....jobs!

[im2kull]

$4.45 Billion

How much of that is tax dollars?

Enough to build 3 brand new Arrowhead stadiums, at todays costs. IE: A redicoulous amount of public funding. An uncalled for amount.

[GRID]

$4.45 Billion is more than the entire amount of money spent on EVERY major project in the Downtown and greater downtown area over the last 15 years..if not more. This project is a mindboggling waste of taxpayer money. Absolutely horrendous. You could build 8 footballs stadiums or baseball stadiums for that much money..easily. We could have DT stadiums, the 3rd hall on the Performing Arts Center, and soooo much more! This is what makes me sick about KC. So much waste.

This is by far the biggest urban planning blunder in the history of KC. This will haunt KC for decades. Not only will it be the biggest wasted opportunity of at least a generation, but this walled off, isolated single use office park will continue to hurt Downtown's ability to bounce back as a job center as the park will eventually get subleased. This Cerner job creation stuff is simply not sustainable and Cerner will eventually downsize, be sold etc and then KC will once again (Sprint Campus part II) have millions of sq ft of office space that will go on the market at way below market rate because it was half built by tax money.

It would be extremely difficult to see the benefit of giving Cerner this much in incentives to go downtown and build four or five 40 story towers, but at least, those towers would add much needed energy and vibrancy to downtown and contribute to other urban redevelopment and investment. Compared to most urban cores, downtown (and really all of urban KC) is still very quiet with very little going on and much of that can be linked to the abysmal lack of new urban core jobs and continued suburban migration of high paying jobs from the city to suburban office parks. Urban KCMo should be capturing more of the new jobs in KC. KC is landing a few new out of town companies, but the local companies already in KC continue to ignore the urban core for these tax payer funded office parks.

And even if they don't go downtown, to give this much money and not even get a modern mixed use development out of the deal that would actually help re brand South Kansas City is a colossal waste of money and just a mind blowing wasted opportunity for all of Kansas City.

[im2kull]

$4.45 Billion is more than the entire amount of money spent on EVERY major project in the Downtown and greater downtown area over the last 15 years..if not more. This project is a mindboggling waste of taxpayer money. Absolutely horrendous. You could build 8 footballs stadiums or baseball stadiums for that much money..easily. We could have DT stadiums, the 3rd hall on the Performing Arts Center, and soooo much more! This is what makes me sick about KC. So much waste.

This is by far the biggest urban planning blunder in the history of KC. This will haunt KC for decades. Not only will it be the biggest wasted opportunity of at least a generation, but this walled off, isolated single use office park will continue to hurt Downtown's ability to bounce back as a job center as the park will eventually get subleased. This Cerner job creation stuff is simply not sustainable and Cerner will eventually downsize, be sold etc and then KC will once again (Sprint Campus part II) have millions of sq ft of office space that will go on the market at way below market rate because it was half built by tax money.

It would be extremely difficult to see the benefit of giving Cerner this much in incentives to go downtown and build four or five 40 story towers, but at least, those towers would add much needed energy and vibrancy to downtown and contribute to other urban redevelopment and investment. Compared to most urban cores, downtown (and really all of urban KC) is still very quiet with very little going on and much of that can be linked to the abysmal lack of new urban core jobs and continued suburban migration of high paying jobs from the city to suburban office parks. Urban KCMo should be capturing more of the new jobs in KC. KC is landing a few new out of town companies, but the local companies already in KC continue to ignore the urban core for these tax payer funded office parks.

And even if they don't go downtown, to give this much money and not even get a modern mixed use development out of the deal that would actually help re brand South Kansas City is a colossal waste of money and just a mind blowing wasted opportunity for all of Kansas City.

Exactly. I could not agree more.

I think one of the biggest errors is that people see "Billion dollar development!" and see the renderings, and think...Oh wow...this is like Zona Rosa, or the Plaza, or storefront retail along downtown..and they FAIL to realize that Cerner DOES NOT allow civilians who DO NOT work for them on their property. We are financing a 100% private piece of property with BILLIONS of dollars of PUBLIC money. Absolute failure, and there is NO way this impacts the city in any way which benefits the general population of the area.

[kboish]

http://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/n ... nsion.html

With Cerner's acquisition of Siemen's Health Services, their employee count jumped 6,000 employees to a total of 22,000 employees. I don't know where all of those currently employees are located, but I'd bet a good portion of them get moved to KC as 3-trails gets built out.

[earthling]

It depends on if Cerner adopts the systems they acquired or if they migrate the data/accounts in Siemen's systems to Cerner's own. If the former, Cerner would likely keep the development for Siemen systems where they currently are. If the latter, it may mean many of the Siemen's jobs go away, not necessarily major increase in KC. It could be a combination of both. Too many unknowns to get any indication.

[pstokely]

http://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/n ... nsion.html

With Cerner's acquisition of Siemen's Health Services, their employee count jumped 6,000 employees to a total of 22,000 employees. I don't know where all of those currently employees are located, but I'd bet a good portion of them get moved to KC as 3-trails gets built out.

where are they currently? Germany? If they're already at a suburban office park they won't notice any different if they do move them there

[jbean3535]

Siemens AG is in Germany but the health IT branch is located over in Pennsylvania.

"The acquisition doesn’t involve relocation of Siemens employees, at least at this point, Burke said. Most of the affected Siemens workers are in Malvern, Pa. Some also are in Germany."

http://www.kansascity.com/news/business ... 33339.html

[moderne]

Crane is up and maybe a couple of floors on the northeast side of the site.

[DaveKCMO]

Cerner will return the debt, Nill said. It will work with the community. It will serve the schools. It is listening to transit concerns.

Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/news/business ... 98548.html

[pash]

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[mister816]

God, every time i think about this project I get more and more upset. I can just imagine having 2 or 3 new 30+ story towers downtown with 1,500 more people in our city's core on a daily basis. It just kills me that the city just let this happen. I HATE this project.